View Full Version : Myths and Conspiracy

06-27-2005, 06:20 PM
Some thoughts to ponder...

Maybe all branches of the government, military, and politics have been manipulated.

Maybe the Urantia Book itself was a preliminary experiment of the same kind of MKULTRA Special Operations?? The undisclosed sleeping human subject who purportedly wrote the UB sounds like a prototype manchurian candidate to me. Maybe the Bible has also been manipulated by the church to augment its own authority in the same manner?? Religious propaganda abounds. Maybe religion has been manipulated.

Maybe economics, banking, stock markets, and currency have also been manipulated. Maybe even the media in all its forms has been manipulated.

Maybe even universities, education, history, and science have been manipulated.

Look for those who promote division, separation, and conflict and you will see the fingers prints of conspiracy. The base of the pyramid has four sides and they are:

[govt-military-politics] vs [banking-industry-media]


[education-universities-science] vs [religion-christian-hebrew].

Each higher level of a side controls the level below in a manner similar to corporate hierarchy, but only the All Seeing Eye, separate and above the pyramid controls it all by promoting secrecy, conflict, and corruption between these separate institutions.

We could of course look on the back of a dollar bill...so tell me if you can;

Why is this [ $ ] "S" with one line the symbol of the dollar when it used to be an "S" with two lines through it?? What does a pyramid have to do with the United States of America?? What is the 13th tribe?? Why does the American Flag in courthouses and courtrooms have a gold trim?? How can the richest country in the world have a national debt estimated to be greater than 3 trillion dollars while no president seems concerned?? What does the richest country use for collateral to borrow even more money every year increasing the national debt?? Who are the creditors that hold the loans of this overwhelming debt and what will happen if they decide to forclose?? Who is going to pay the cost of apathy that we mistakenly call freedom?????


06-27-2005, 08:56 PM
RH, you have ask quite a few questions, bro.:lite chuc Did you have any answers or thoughts as to the answers? I did a little research and found some interesting links that might help answer a few. Then on the other hand, may just spark more questions. We'll start with the "Eye and Pirimid" on our dollar bill.

http://www.treas.gov/education/faq/images/faq_q.gif What is the significance of the symbols on the back of the one-dollar bill? I'm particularly interested in the eye and the pyramid.

http://www.treas.gov/education/faq/images/faq_a.gif The eye and the pyramid shown on the reverse side of the one-dollar bill are in the Great Seal of the United States. The Great Seal was first used on the reverse of the one-dollar Federal Reserve note in 1935. The Department of State is the official keeper of the Seal. They believe that the most accurate explanation of a pyramid on the Great Seal is that it symbolizes strength and durability. The unfinished pyramid means that the United States will always grow, improve and build. In addition, the "All-Seeing Eye" located above the pyramid suggests the importance of divine guidance in favor of the American cause. The inscription ANNUIT COEPTIS translates as "He (God) has favored our undertakings," and refers to the many instances of Divine Providence during our Government's formation. In addition, the inscription NOVUS ORDO SECLORUM translates as "A new order of the ages," and signifies a new American era.
Reference: http://www.treas.gov/education/faq/...traits.shtml#q3 (http://www.treas.gov/education/faq/currency/portraits.shtml#q3)

Then, here are a few more links you might care to investgate. Seems the Masons have took to the internet since the movie "National Treasure".



06-28-2005, 01:07 PM
Nice try Michaeld!! Please try again. I have already done considerable research on this subject, allthough, I am by no means an expert. I just find it extremely fascinating!!

But I would like to suggest that Urantia Board members do their own research concerning the language of symbols if they're interested. The true meaning of a symbol is most easily disguised and misrepresented. This, in my opinion, has happened not only with the patriotic symbols of America, but with the symbology of the bible as well. Indeed, much of what I'm being taught in college is also a misrepresentation. 'Graduation' means gradual indoctrination by the powers-that-be.

There seems to be a subtle kind of power in symbols. Which is [I guess] why people are so fascinated by astrology, numerology, tarot, and kabbala. These olden forms of divination have long been used by some to determine the "will of God." I do not claim to hear the voice of God, but in my quiet meditations, I quite often see symbols which I must endeavor to interpret the correct meaning of that which I am being shown. Dreams are also symbolic of course. Myths and legends are crouched in symbology. Our subconscious mind is highly suseptable to this type of power which can be used to indoctrinate, program,and control us. It can also bring great spiritual understanding and awareness.

As I understand it; the pyramid is one symbol of our level of consciousness some call the third density. Actually this symbol is one of the platonic solids called an octahedron which could be described as two pyramids base to base and oriented in opposite directions, in perfect ratio of pi, surrounded by a sphere. Being eight sided; an octahedron is 2x2x2 or 2^3 which also might describe our DNA structure as well. This symbol is not only a geometric shape, but a musical note and a color of light as well. There is a reason why the pyramid structure has been used all over our world. Obviously, the Great Pyramids are a powerfull example of this symbolic reality.

It would seem that many fraternal organizations and secret societies highly value the language of symbols. The Freemasons are most deffinately one example of this, especially since all the founding fathers were masons.

Unfortunately, the relationship between myth, legend, symbology, conspiracy, and secret societies has become so convoluted and complex over the centuries that, like an onion, there is layer upon layer of deception that must be peeled away before any degree of truth can be obtained.

However, there are many qualified researchers who are attempting to do just that and many of them write books, do talk shows, and post their findings on the internet. There is of course, Coast to Coast AM radio which has had many guest speakers on this topic. I would think that many are sincere, but there are also those who attempt further deception.


06-30-2005, 08:04 AM
Freemason Symbology and the Dollar Bill

Quotes from Michael Tsarion

http://www.taroscopes.com/astro-theology/astrotheology.html#four.cults (http://www.taroscopes.com/astro-theology/astrotheology.html#four.cults)

“Among the many symbols used, the sun is often represented by the "All Seeing Eye" of the god of light. This symbol is, suggestively, seen above an Egyptian pyramid. It has been called the eye of Ra, or of Horus, but it is really the eye of Aton/Jehovah/Adonai, the god of the monotheistic Akhenaton and his bloodline. Those who worship this god, those behind the thrones of power today, refer to themselves as the "Illumined Ones," or the "Elites." Within their enclaves they know themselves as "Luciferians" as is known by those researchers who have taken the time to read their various manifestos. This symbol, of the all-seeing eye, can be seen emblazoned on the documents of the nefarious and powerful secret society, called the Illuminati, which infiltrated Freemasonry (and other guilds and institutions), and on the American one dollar bill. Adjacent to this symbol, on the dollar bill, is the bald eagle with the thirteen arrows and olive leaves.”

“This eagle is the symbol for the Tribe of Manasseh, and was also used by the Rothschild Dynasty (one of the major servants of the descendents of the renegade Cult of Aton). The pyramid with the eye can also be seen today on innumerable corporate logos, on the emblems of governments, religious organizations, and on many media consortiums, which are either owned or controlled by these selfsame oligarchies. Neither the pyramid nor the eagle are American symbols. And let us bear in mind, from now on, that the generic terms "Israelite" and "Hebrew" denote those people who had spent time in Egypt, and is not specifically a racial or religious term. These terms were used more as titles, and were adopted to signify the Jews and other sundry tribes and racial groups that were once resident in Egypt and who were fond affiliates, and even servants of, the Cult of Aton (Adonai/Jehovah/Yahweh). The non-racial term "Israelite" was adopted by those without legitimate claim to such ancestry and by those who seek to disguise their origins. Since scholars, and history, can find little trace of any "Israelties" the ruse was an excellent one, and has worked supremely well thus far.”

Note A: The term "Israelite," was a sacred Egyptian term and referred to the knowledgeable ones. The word Israel, as we saw, was later adopted to express the coming together of the Cults of Power. This is probably the reason why the term Israelite was used by each Cult, including the Solar Cult of Aton. It is a term which connotative rather than denotative. The same thing applies to the Welsh, Scotts, Irish and English when they refer to themselves as "British." When the Bible was being conceived, in Rome, it was decided that the word and concept of Israel should be personified. For reasons which are NOT detailed, Jacob - son of Abraham - was renamed Israel by God. This act of "renaming" (Genesis 35:9) is just one of several clever ploys used by the Bible's mythographers in Babylon and Rome to distort history and to leave false trails.

Note B: The labyrinthine nonsense of the Bible only seems complicated because modern Christians attempt to distinguish themselves from Jews by saying that they are descended from all twelve tribes, whereas the Jews are only descended from one tribe, that of Judah, the fourth son of Jacob. Once we realize that neither the Christians nor the Jews can prove any such descent, all is made clear. And putting words into the mouth of Jesus which indicate that he was also fixated on his physical lineage was a shoddy manner of legitimizing these unsustainable claims. Obviously, if Jesus was indeed born of a virgin, by way of the Holy Spirit, and not from his physical father Joseph, as the New Testament asserts, then he can have no lineage other than a divine one. The Christians who assert a connection to ancient lost tribes are in contradiction to the message of Christ. Only those who do not care about Christ's moral and spiritual message, and who desire to connect themselves to the god Jehovah, and his "Covenant" of power and dominion, waste their time with physical descent. Such types betray the fact that it is physical, and material power and sovereignty that concerns them, not spiritual and moral. Such individuals should call themselves what they truly are - Levites, Pharisees, hypocrites and liars all, wallowing in contradiction and dancing on the strings pulled from above by the forces that created the whole drama, from their Babylonian Academies and Roman Scriptoriums.

Note C: The "Tribe of Manasseh" like all other tribes, have long since departed from history, if they ever existed at all. There is precious little to support the existence of this, or any other "Israelite" tribe. The fiction of the ten tribes is a conveniently holy sounding device, or ruse, behind which the devilish Solar Cult can remain hidden. Let it be known that when we read the terms Israel, Israelite, Hebrew, Chosen, etc., we are to think - Judahite, Levite, Pharisee, and Cult of Aton. This will make reading and understanding the "scriptures" a great deal easier. (The Levites were always considered a tribe apart. Their duties were mostly militaristic and administrative, but they had particular jurisdiction over temple sacrifices). The term Juda comes from the Hebrew Huda, meaning the "Shining" or "Illustrious Ones" in reference to the Cult of Aton, and not to some black-robe-wearing Priestarchy. In short, never let us forget that the Bible is a propaganda manifesto with little to no historical or biographical veracity. As historians frustrate themselves searching for non-existent old-world tribes, the Cult of Aton hides in plain sight, to ply its abominable trade and spread its infection the world over. Its chiefs dance upon their desks in merriment over our ignorance and folly.

“The Latin inscription on the banner around the Judaic eagle's head (below the Star of David) - E Pluribus Unum ("From the Many - the One") refers to the god of the henotheistic Judahites, who was, quite literally, chosen from the many gods of antiquity, and not to any high-fluting concept of Fabian Humanism. It is also a cryptic reference to the separatist, monotheistic, light-worshipping Cult of Aton, who have hidden their very physical ancestry behind the myriad cults, religions and secret societies of history, many of which are of their own creation. Because they have concealed themselves behind the so-called twelve tribes of "Israel," their denoting number is thirteen. This number appears all over the US one dollar note, and appears on many national flags, coins and coats-of-arms. The European Union run the world from the thirteenth floor of their building in Brussels, Belgium.”

“Controlled and funded by the Cult of Aton, the Judahites were content to eventually accept Aton, (or Adonai) as their god. The thirteen levels of the pyramid and the thirteen stars above the eagle's head, together with every other emblem therein, represent the Ancient Cults, and the Solar Cult of Aton which conceals itself behind Judaism, Christianity, and behind secret societies such as the Knights of Columbus, the Knights Templar, the Freemasons, Jesuits, and the Illuminati, etc,. If we look closely, we will see 33 feathers in the wing of Aton’s Eagle. This number represents the Masonic Order, which has 33 main degrees of initiation in its hierarchical, pyramidical structure. This occult family, of Aton, sits at the top of the power pyramid, and has designed, funded and controlled operations through the time of the Levites, Pharisees, Greeks, Romans, Venetians, the Hanovers of Holland, the royal elites of England (Plantagenet, Tudor, Stuart and Windsor dynasties), through the world's first exploitatory conglomerates such as the East-Indian Company and Russell Trust (Virginia and Hudson Bay Companies), which were behind the "discovery" of America's original thirteen states (New Israel), and which own and control both political parties within America today.”

“This cabal also funds and controls the world's major charities, the majority of the US Christian Protestant (pro-Zionist) Evangelist Pastors, the newspapers and media networks for the youth, the music and pharmaceutical monopolies, the Federal Reserve and its banks, the United Nations, the Vatican and the Jesuits, and the major think-tanks and space programs (NASA - "...the Eagle has landed"). The symbols on the currency (notes and coins) that government (British and American) buys from the private banks in order to sustain its existence, furnish the student with proof-positive as to the truth of this last statement. Moreover, the terms "Camp David" and "Capitol Hill" are oblique references to the city of Jerusalem, and to Levite tradition. The term "breaking the law" is an oblique reference to Moses (Akhenaton) literally breaking the Law of the Covenant. The very red carpet that the potentates and politicians habitually walk upon, represents the bloodline of the ancient Luciferian dynasty whose origins are lost in the distant mists of time.”

“Though many of the world's orders and fraternities where created and funded by Cult of Aton, some were not. And because one has to advance quite high in Masonic ranks before becoming privy to the real agenda, a few well-meaning Masons have, due to their natural humanism, attempted to expose the darker corners of their own organization. Winston Churchill was one such whistle-blower. For a short period during his political career he seemed dedicated to exposing corruption in high places. When such a whistle-blower operates, from within the system, the "higher-ups" have two main ways of dealing with them. The first method commonly used is assassination, of either the professional or the physical kind. The second method involves initiating the whistle-blower into a higher position, providing them a deeper insight into the master plan than they possessed before advancement. This promotion in rank can be attended by material reward also. This method has proved very successful down through the years, and has served to silence many a potentially rogue voice. Some very esteemed Masons spoke openly against what they imagined to be the subversion of their humanitarian order. Perhaps, they took Masonry for what it was meant to be, for what it was said to be, or for what they imagined it to be, as they reverently advanced through its many ranks. Masons are, after all, not the only ones to be duped by the company they keep or by the societies they serve. In any case, the warning calls of the suspicious and aware, in Masonry, went largely unheeded.”

“Behind the Masonic Lodges hides the same Cult of Aton, which fashioned Christianity, formed the Vatican, the Illuminati, which incorporated the Knights Templar, and which operates behind the world's other myriad secret societies. The fact that the central symbolism of Masonry involves the Temple of Solomon, should have alerted us to this fact long ago. Now, it happens that Freemasons, who refer to themselves as "Sons of the Sun" (Phre-Massen), are distinguished by the symbols that they commonly use on their lodges and on their literature. And it is via a study of their symbolism that we can decode their true function and agenda.”

“The three symbols which they universally employ are the Compass, the Square and the letter G. Many are the interpretations as to what these symbols mean and as to where they actually originate. A close reading of Masonic documents reveals a plethora of information and disinformation regarding the origin and significance of these three symbols. Space does not permit a thorough analysis presently. However, it is important to bring out something concerning the letter "G," which is a great Masonic sigil (secret sign). Scholars have concluded that it refers to God, to Geometry, to Gaia, to Generation (sex), to the Hunab Ku of the Maya Shamans, to Geb the ancient Egyptian god of the phallus and the Earth, and to the sacred Spiral, etc,. Naturally, due to the synthetic and ambivalent quality of symbols, all these interpretations might be said to be true. Symbols have endless permutations.”

“Each of these interpretations can be accepted, and each can also be refuted after separate but plausible argument and critique. It is from a close reading of Masonic and Levitical symbolism that an important clue as to the letter's actual occult origin is yielded, one that gives greater credence to our present thesis.”

“After the massacres and devastation by Vespasian's Roman forces in Jerusalem, the Levite echelon moved on to Jamnia and Usha, in Babylon, and formed their Talmudic Academies which lasted for centuries. It was there that they collated all the esoteric knowledge that they had acquired from Egypt. And it was there that they honed their plans for world domination. At this time the dispersed lower-class Judahites of the world knew to look to Babylon, to Jamnia, Usha, Sura, and Pumbedita, and to the Talmudic Academies, for their guidance and learning. Now, interestingly, the head potentates of these ancient academies, the elites of Talmudic scholarship, were known as the "Gaonim." These Gaonim were considered princes of sacred knowledge and, as such, they commanded the greatest reverence imaginable. It is, therefore, our opinion that these Levitical Gaonim, resident in Babylon, were the descendants of the even more ancient Cult of Aton. And, furthermore, it is our contention that the Masonic letter or cipher "G" stands for these self-proclaimed Exilarchs, these Princes - the GAONIM, of the Babylonian GAONATE. In short, we do not think that it is far-fetched to suppose that the Compass and Square might refer to the builder's guilds and the skill of physical masonry which constructed the Temple of Sol-Aton; and to likewise suppose the "G" to be the arcane sign of the Priest-King cabal, and their god, who were worshipped in it. Though the knowledge of such temple construction may have rested for a time in Palestine and later Babylon it should be obvious, to even a layperson, that it originated in Egypt.”

“The most beloved symbol to Freemasons, and those who control this order, is the Egyptian Pyramid. They prefer the pyramid with thirteen levels, and a detached two-dimensional capstone and "all-seeing" eye, for the reasons mentioned above. But let us not forget that any true pyramid has four sides or faces. A pyramid is made from four triangles. Many mysteries are concealed in this design. But the power-elite at the summit know the reason for the four faces.”

“Basically, their secret control operates downward through the thirteen levels, yes. But it also first fans out in the four main directions symbolized by the four identical faces of the power-pyramid. That is, it operates simultaneously via four separate or sub-pyramids. After all, a pyramid would not exist without its four sides reaching upward to become the apex. So, in practice, the power of the supreme Sun Order, the Cult of Aton, is invested in four connected, but self-governing divisions or executors. If one contingent should fail, or be uncovered and thwarted, the agenda continues unmolested via the other three agents. These four "faces" are Judeo-Christianity (and the other orthodox religions), the military, the various scientific, educational and media institutions of the world, and the Banks. Each division, or face, has its own apex (controlling officers) who organize and govern the lower levels of its "face." However, these privileged lieutenants answer to the supreme invisible "Generals," above them. The Masonic and educational fraternities are designed upon the cell-structure to facilitate this occult control, and to ensure that no one part within the hierarchy conceives of what is really happening around, or above it.”

“The edifice of the New World Order is almost complete. It has been constructed brick by "Masonic" brick down through the centuries. The last layer is in place, and only the capstone remains to be set. When the time is right the architects of doom will finally set it in its place. Then after their towering pyramid of control and tyranny is complete, the black light of the All-Seeing Eye will be cast down upon the whole world, and men and women will exist and labor beneath its shadow, the dire shadow of their own great tombstone that they have helped create by their apathy and ignorance, and upon which their own hearts will be torn out and sacrificed to the blood-gorged gods. True, no slaves were involved in the construction of the real pyramid at Giza. That much has been historically proven. But the virtual pyramid of the Luciferian Brotherhoods exists entirely due to slavery, slavery not of ancient Jews and Egyptians, but of all humanity.”

“Yes, the unenviable task of revealing the origins, evolution and agendas of this greatest of mind-control programs, Judeo-Christianity, may be justifiably considered futile in the extreme. Yes, the task of rearranging furniture on the Titanic might seem sadly comical to most who still possess sanity in these insane times. However, should but ONE person be awakened, after pausing to read our audacious "graffiti" upon the walls of our prison-house, it is enough. For unlike the priests and popes of this world, our endeavor is not to "save" lives or souls, but to save TRUTH...so that it may nourish true Humanity, should it ever eventually be conceived, take birth, and find a home in the world of tomorrow.”

08-04-2005, 03:32 AM
Hi Rherman,

I must congratulate you on your in-depth research and your ongoing resolve to uncover the truth no matter where it may lead.

I have been reading from a very interesting website: Steadman‘s “Orbit Impact“.

The story from a very brave American, Kay Griggs who was the wife of a high ranking officer in the Marine Corps.

What she had to say about the upper echelons of power was sickening.

She comes across as totally honest and I must say believable in what she revealed about the corruption and wickedness in high places of government.

Her life would surely be threatened from the revelations of all the named, politically famous people involved and known personally by her and from the diary kept by her husband. http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/

When I say this is truly sickening, you will know what I mean when you view the eight hours of video from this website. I would like to know yours and others reactions to this information that was revealed in 1998 but has only recently made it to the internet.tp://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/ (http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/)
Seems that the URL disappears and I cannot edit it but click on the first one and ignore the others,

08-04-2005, 04:59 PM

Relative to such information truth exists in two dimensions. The first dimension is that of objective reality and thus is concerned with the difference between fiction and fact. The second dimension of truth concerns the efficacy of response options "in light" of new facts with consideration for one's circumstances and opportunities to influence the evolution of affairs for God's purposes. In this second dimension, therefore, truth is determined not by human understanding but by the level of one's success at discerning the will of God. The greater the discernment the more efficacious, and thus more TRUTHful, the response to objective truths will be.

"I AM the way, the TRUTH, and the life."

TRUTH, in motion, IS and can only BE represented by adherence to the LIVING WILL of God.

Jesus walked the way, as truth, and, in God, was and is alive.



08-04-2005, 07:54 PM
Hello Frogigr,

I am not sure what you are referring too here. Are you saying that there are two sides to every story and there may be something going on in the higher echelons that is working out the Fathers will?

Do you think that in the bigger picture, beyond our comprehension, all is proceeding in an orderly manner, according to some divine plan?

If so, this would contravene the law of free of will expression and would suggest predestination.

In my opinion the greater discernment is not possible under the quarantine of ignorance that we have been placed in.

However, in light of any new facts that may emerge it becomes more important to keep an open mind, so that these facts can be configured into the big picture and one of my strongest tenets is always to be open to new revelations in the quest for truth.

Are you aware of any new facts that might shed more light on the situation?


08-04-2005, 08:32 PM

Humanity's path is pre-destined in the sense that sufficient number of representatives of humanity will evolve into experience of and in God in a manner that serve God's purposes. Many individual lives are pre-destined to experience futures and fulfull purposes within a range of potential futures. As an analogy, it could be said that two sons of a single father are pre-destined to be college athletic stars because of the combination of their natural athleticism and their upbringing. It could even known by the Universe that one will play football and the other basketball. Even if this much was known there would be a lot left to be determined by the choices of the brothers within a certain parameter of possibilties. Who will play what sport and what will mama think about it all? I can't know.

The path of mankind, or a signficant portion of mankind, is pre-destined to fullfill the fundamental purposes for which mankind was created and, to use a common narrative, Lucifer's rebellion was allowed. What sports different beings will play and what the atmosphere of the arena will be when the boys take the field and court will be the product of the choice of freewill beings with the most critical plays being called by point guards and quarterbacks whose "reads" and "playbooks" are alligned with their coach and Father, God.

Beings "surrendered" to God cannot be said to exist in a state of quarantine and all that is to be discerned is the play that is being called in from the sidelines. Often times that play will be based on something that can only be seen from the sky box where the offensive coordinator resides and will be one that does not make sense to the quarterback. It becomes harder on the quarterback still because though he is "committed" to running the coach's plays and wears headphones in his helmet that enable him to hear it "phoned in" he has limited time to explain it in the huddle and the linemen who see only the trenches have a particularly hard time understanding many play calls based on a higher and more expansive view of the action.

I am comfortable presenting myself to you in the capacity of one who would appropriately be considered a source of "revelation". If I err in saying so I invite God to correct me on this point and trust that if you will surrender your own discernment to God then you will have no problem "receiving" from me that which will best serve your journey while "blocking" that which would confuse it. Different "receivers" are meant to catch different balls at different times.

Finally, relative to your pre-destination question it may help to think of it like this. If you drop a tadpole into the main current of a river just before a waterfall the current WILL sweep it over the falls. Furthermore, if the tadpole is healthy, you can be quite certain that it is pre-destined to emerge on dry land somewhere down river on the "other side" of the falls. This does not mean, however, that he is "pre-destined" to appear as a frog on a particular spot of land at a particular point in time. Nor does it preclude said frog from sunning on a rock a time or two in the middle of said river before first "taking to the bank". Having said this, you may certainly take the frog's emergence to the bank.

Hope that helps.



08-04-2005, 09:31 PM

I can share thoughts and inspirations and I can share objective facts. Several objective facts of my recent experiences are these. About a month ago I was introduced to an elder African-American gentleman with whom I developed a spiritual rapport. A week thereafter, and very much inspred by God to do so, I called him to see if I could visit him in his home. At the conclusion of a nice visit of a couple of hours I asked him if he would recommend a book for me to read. He recommened two:

"Manchild in the Promised Land", by Claude Brown

"Autobiography of Malcolm X", Malcolm X

Tonight, almost immediately after posting my previous response to you, I went upstairs to read the last 50 pages of "Manchild". Just minutes ago, and with no real explanation for it, I suddenly put the book down and reached under my bedside table and grabbed my Urantia Book which I open up from time to time but do not read on any regular basis. Among quite a few pages to choose from I made no conscious choice of what to read but simply flipped it open.......to page 1918.

We're all mysteries to ourselves and to others and both "emerge" and "reveal" at our own pace and in different roles. We must be willing to receive the dots before we can connect them. As they and I "connect" I enjoy sharing some of mine.



08-06-2005, 12:41 AM
Hello Frogihr
I can’t argue with you on the fundamentals of predestination but this point of spirit gravity towards God, is generally accepted anyway. Our quest for the great originator of this system, God the Father/Mother is even the hoped for destination of the revelators and also for most of the other celestial communications we have received as revelation. If you want to call this pre-destination so be it.
As you point out in your following post we are mysteries to ourselves and others. God is mystery also, though to me it is obvious that God is everywhere in existence itself brings to my mind this concept.

If God is everywhere, IS all things and IN all things we are part of him and not the other way round that he is part of us. If this were so we would have to think of what makes up the physical/ spiritual bodies and mind material we use. If we separate God from it, we are mentally saying that God exists in an environment created for him and all else is from some other source.

On delving deeper into this concept we would ascertain that every living soul, be they from the earth, or existing on any other sphere or environment throughout the universe of universes, is in fact “God” as a whole entity.

This is indeed an awe inspiring thing to contemplate because it means that God is you, me and everyone else in existence working out his plan. It means that we are all God, yet with an imposed conception of separation that does not really exist, we only perceive it that way.

If we accept this then we can philosophise that Father is being us in order to experience the evolution from the lowest form of life to perfection. This is exactly what the philosophy of the UB says in the contemplation of the mysterious unqualified absolute. The trouble with the UB is that it uses separation from God in order to fit the concept. It shows that the UB, even though professedly from the “Most High” entities, is still a philosophical work and that the great creator of existence is still as much a mystery to them as it is to us. So it is that we partake of the same journey that they are on and in doing so we are one with them. Now I think I see in your own posts that some of these ideas are going on your mind also.
We now come to the subject of sin and evil, that God could not want to experience such things in his evolutionary quest. This is where the subject of separation reaches a blockage in our conception. A new philosophy to explain this becomes painfully necessary but there are books that have done this with greater clarity than the UB.

However the channelling sources of other books have been greatly discouraged in the UB. To some psychics like the late Harold Sherman, this was caused directly by the intervention of Dr William Sadler who could not accept spiritual phenomena in any form as authentic. If you have not read the Sherman Diaries, I recommend them, they opened my eyes as to some of the messages received that were never entered into the final publication of the Urantia Book, yet were read to the early study groups by Bill Sadler. These apocrypha were full of fantastic revelations concerning the visits by celestials to this world and their obvious manipulation of humanity by using vast numbers of individuals as mediums throughout the world.

Another book that would not be acceptable to Dr Sadler is available on Square Circles, called “The Blue Island“ as I mentioned in another post. This book is from a person who perished physically in the Titanic disaster and he reveals what happens when the body dies yet life continues on. Even for those who we denote as wicked, they are still left to their own devices to find God and this would include all spirits good and evil.

So, Yes! In this roundabout way we could indeed say all things are predestined. Yet is eternity is provided for it?

If we look into this we would then have to wonder if God would ever be successful in eventuating himself as the fully Qualified Absolute with eternity as the timeline? We would then have to reconsider that predestination is a philosophical concept that will never happen.

I could go on with the assumption that time does not really exist but we really are in the realms of speculation and I must confess that I am still an ignorant seeker of truth. I will soak up any new knowledge like a sponge for further consideration but I also know that we are all on the same journey. We can pose concepts but Father is still a mystery to us all. I see this mystery as a good thing, while the mystery remains the higher powers cannot rule as powers unto themselves, thus they have to be careful in the way they treat the lower entities like ourselves, we are part of God also. Sorry, this post is getting out of the thread of Myth and Conspiracy.

08-07-2005, 04:50 PM

That was an exceptional post and I appreciate the effort you have put into our correspondence. I also appreciate very much your reading recommendations. Now is not a good time for me to continue this conversation but I have printed your post and filed among writings I check in on again as inspired to do so. I look forward to communicating further with you over time and appreciate your contributions to my thought processes and this board.



08-12-2005, 09:02 AM
Its good to hear from you again Mick and thanks to all who've participated in this ad hoc thread. Thanks to frogigr for the suggested books and to Mick for the link. I'd like to post a short excerpt from the link:


"If the public wakes up, a vast historical change could then begin to unfold. As ordinary people across the world realize that the whole system of beliefs, dogmas, ideologies, hostilities, battles and rivalries by which we live are an illusion created by a cynical leadership, and do not emerge out of the hearts of the people, it could be that mankind will refocus on the only thing that has ever mattered, from the beginning of history: that each individual obtain sufficient prosperity and happiness, in a peaceful context, to express all of his potential into the world, and taste of this life to the fullest."

quote from Whitley Strieber A Nation in Peril?
Tuesday July 12th, 2005